First Timers looking to be awestruck while avoiding crowds

[RCRanger03]

Hey, this is my first post here so i hope I'm not posting this in the wrong place

Me and a Friend are going on a 30 day 6000 mile roadtrip around the western US next summer and one of the stops were most excited about is Yosemite.

We'll both be 21 and in excellent physical condition, we love to camp and hike, and we would like to avoid the crowds if possible, but we dont want to miss out on something well "unmissable" like going to the top of the half dome (unless ive been misled and its not worth it, if so please let me know)... What exactly would you suggest we do if we have 2 1/2 days to spend there, if something truly special is only possible with 3 days i can more than likely make it happen but our outline as of now has us 3 nights and 2 days.

Really looking forward to yalls responses, and thanks for reading

[AlmostThere]

The single most popular trail in the park is the Half Dome hike, and the evidence is in the number of pit toilets you will find along it.

Do you want to see just one scenic area, or do a tour of the park's main sights? That's not hardly any time at all and there is a LOT of park even if you only drive through it. If you are interested in doing many 1-10 mile scenic hikes, or a loop of some sort, in the higher elevations, focus on Tioga Pass trails.

You have enough lead time to plan for faxing permit applications at 12:01 am the first day they are reservable. (Yes, this is necessary to get a reserved wilderness permit for a trail like Sunrise in summer.) A really great hike to see the major vista points along the south rim, with a couple of nights in the wilderness, would be Sunrise trailhead at Tenaya Lake, to Clouds Rest, to Half Dome and Little Yosemite Valley, to Happy Isles - or if you're really feeling ambitious and strong, and don't mind the mileage, from LYV to Glacier Point via the Panorama Trail. Then down the four mile trail, which is how to get the best views from that trail, and hop the hiker bus back to Tioga/Tenaya Lake to get the car after a night in the backpacker campground in the valley. If you opt for this route put a second choice trailhead on the permit. Cathedral adds a few miles but is do-able.

From about Half Dome on, you will be surrounded by tourist day hikers, but this is the nature of the busiest national park in the park system. The scenery is totally worth it. Look at a good topo map and get an idea of the mileages and camp spots. Be mindful that you will not be allowed to camp between Little Yosemite Valley and the Ilillouette drainage (Panorama) or between LYV and Happy Isles.

[Random Walker]

Check out Sierra Point.

[RCRanger03]

Well ive had some trouble finding a good trail map online maybe yall can help me figure out if i'm crazy with this

So we arrive in the middle of the first day from the south, i figure we can do a little stop at Mariposa Grove on our drive in, then to our campsite? Reserved in advance of course hopefully Yosemite Valley. Then here comes the fun part. Starting as early as we can four mile trail to Glacier Point (break) Panorama trail to Little Yosemite Valley (camp for the night?) Then get up super early and hit Half Dome and back, get back shuttle from happy valley back to wherever (where exactly is my car going to be through all of this?) then drive out of the park along tiago road.

Is this stupid for 2 and 1/2 days? Set me straight oh wise gurus

[balzaccom]

It will take you at LEAST an hour to drive from Mariposa Grove to the Valley...and I would spend at least one-two hours at Mariposa Grove. If you want to get even a little bit away from the crowds.

As for your next day. Four mile trail is very steep. I don't think I would want to hike that trail with a backpack, and then continue on for another six miles to LYV. WHy not take the shuttle to Glacier Point? It would save your legs and backs, and still let you hike the best part of the trip, which is the Panorama trail. That would leave your car at a lot in the Valley, which is where you will end up after your trip to Half Dome. Half Dome to Happy Isles with a backpack will tire you out...and it's about two hours from Happy Isles to Tuolumne Meadows and Tioga Pass. And when you get there, you are going to wish you had more time to poke around!

[RCRanger03]

I thought that's what yall might say

Would yall recomend doing a night hike to half dome to see the sunrise? I figure if we do that we'll have time to lazily drive to tuolemne meadows and maybe poke around like you said and maybe camp there for our last night...

So the new version would look like

Day 1 - arrive midday or later check out mariposa then camp in yosite valley
Day 2 - wake up early to get a jump on crowds and heat and shuttle to glacier point then hike Panorama trail ending in happy isles/little yosemite? (which one) that would be early afternoonish do you think it would be unwise to sneak up to that Sierra point random walker suggested. Anyways zonk out until midnight in little yosemite
Day 3 - hike to the top of half dome to see sunrise be back around 10-11 am shuttle back to car in yosemite valley drive to tuolemne meadows and lounge/poke around for a while then camp for the night and drive out the next morning

I really appreciate yall being so helpful and patient with my naivety to this matter

[balzaccom]

Little Yosemite is six miles and 1500 feet above Happy Isles--that's a big differerence. I assumed that you had Wilderness permits tocamp in LYV. If you do not, you won't be able to do that. What I was suggesting was a shuttle to Glacier Point, and then a backpack to LYV--you will need a permit for this!. And sleep that night above Nevada Falls, closer to Half Dome. The next day, get up and day hike up and back to Half Dome (isn't that about 2-3 miles each way---but bear in mind the cables will take a LONG time) ...picking up your pack for the final 5-6 miles back to Happy Isles.

With luck, an early start, and without too much delay on Half Dome, you might get up to the top of Half Dome by 9 and back to your packs by 11--and that would make an easy trek back to Happy Isles by 2:30 or 3. Plenty of time to drive two hours to Tuolumne Meadows and have a little time to explore there---but you won't get a campsite there, I don't think! They have been booked for months.

[balzaccom]

Oh--and if you are looking to avoid the crowds...boy are you going to the wrong places!

[RCRanger03]

As I explained in the first post this is all research for a giant roadtrip I'm taking a year from now. Are you saying that reservations a year from now are filled?

Also we would like to avoid crowds but I got the impression that the limited time we have isn't conducive to doing so, which is why I'm trying to pick the more strenuous suggestions tall have made and go early in the morning to avoid at least some of the crowds

We don't expect to see everything, but we're trying to see some spectacularness in our limited timeframe, and I don't like to admit this but I may never get the chance to go back (at least in a capacity of peaking youth health and athleticism without having to worry about things like brown bears eating my childre)

sorry to be repeditive but in case it gets lost in this flurry... What are yalls thoughts on doing half dome midnight to sunrise so you get to watch at the top?

[AlmostThere]

Day 1 - arrive midday or later check out mariposa then camp in yosite valley
Day 2 - wake up early to get a jump on crowds and heat and shuttle to glacier point then hike Panorama trail ending in happy isles/little yosemite? (which one) that would be early afternoonish do you think it would be unwise to sneak up to that Sierra point random walker suggested. Anyways zonk out until midnight in little yosemite
Day 3 - hike to the top of half dome to see sunrise be back around 10-11 am shuttle back to car in yosemite valley drive to tuolemne meadows and lounge/poke around for a while then camp for the night and drive out the next morning

By the way, there are no brown bears in Yosemite, just black, and they don't eat children. The only injury to a child in my memory was an incident where the child was sleeping in a tent containing food - the bear was not expecting to find a panicked youngster, just easy calories.

You will want a reservation for any campsite within the car campgrounds a year in advance, yes. You will be able to get wilderness permits six months in advance - for trailheads like Happy Isles, if you are unable to be flexible on the date, you need to fax it in ASAP starting at 12 midnight the day the reservable permits are available (YES, it's true, reservations are that hard to get). If you are able to get into the wilderness office in the valley very early the day BEFORE you want to backpack from Happy Isles to LYV, you may be able to get walkin permits for free. You will need a wilderness permit to spend a night in Little Yosemite Valley, as it is for backpackers only. The ranger lives up there and checks every night for permits and for appropriate food storage, as the bears are VERY bad. The ranger has been known to come through at midnight, just to catch people with plans of sneaking in very late and leave early. There is a fine if you sleep there without a permit.

The shuttles do NOT run to Glacier Point. There is a tour bus for 25/person (one way ticket) departing from Yosemite Lodge that does. It departs at 8:30 am, 10 am and 1:30 pm.

Sierra Point is a short but strenuous hike from the Happy Isles trailhead, on a decommissioned trail. Info http://www.summitpost.org/route/160150/sierra-point.html

[RCRanger03]

The bear thing was a joke lol

The information I had said that the earliest advance reservations were 5 months not a year... Is that info wrong?

[AlmostThere]

http://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/wildpermitdates.htm

This is a table for when wilderness permits are available for specific days.

And it turns out I was wrong - I think I have flawed memory, as for the past (censored) years I have not even tried to car camp in Yosemite. I always get wilderness permits. Here is the text from this page:

"Campground reservations are available in blocks of one month at a time, up to five months in advance, on the 15th of each month at 7 am Pacific time. Be aware that nearly all reservations for the months of May through September and for some other weekends are filled the first day they become available (often within minutes after 7 am)!"

[RCRanger03]

Well i dont "want" to car camp i just dont know what to do with my car while i'm backpacking in the park, and we're coming into yosemite during the afternoon... As well as we need to get back to it so we can drive back out the otherside of the park to continue our roadtrip.

Maybe as someone who is completely naive in the ways of Yosemite i've gone about this thread in the wrong way, and a different approach is in order.

(keep in mind that all of this is a year from now) Me and my companion (both 21 in top shape) are arriving to the Yosemite area around midday to early afternoon day one, then we have the entirety of days 2 and 3 for doing some wicked awesome packpacking through the park. Day 4 we drive Tiago Road out of the park... How would you go about planning this trip?

[AlmostThere]

If you're backpacking you just park in trailhead parking, which in some cases is a lot and in others is a pullout along the side of the road. Last week we parked in the lot at the wilderness center and one of our cars ended up along the road to the lodge at Tuolumne.

I'm offering you info on car camping because you said "camp in the valley" - there are three ways to do that. If you are able to pick up the permit the day you get there, you can stay in one of the backpacker campgrounds. If you don't get to the wilderness office before it closes, you will end up in a first come/first serve campground like Camp Four (the climber's camp) - but if you arrive too late to get the permit, these will often fill up before noon so this is unreliable. If you have a reservation in the car campgrounds you are assured a spot if you let them know you will be a late arrival. The only other way to stay in the valley is to hope there is a cancellation in the campgrounds or in the tent cabins, or stay at one of the lodges. You can't just camp. You can't sleep in the car at the trailhead. You can't just stop in a pullout. If you are departing on the trail from trailhead parking the day you arrive, you will be facing a four mile from the trailhead restriction on camping - except for Happy Isles, which does not allow you to camp until you are all the way to Little Yosemite Valley. So if you arrive at 4:30, manage to get the permit, and start hiking, you will be hiking in the dark after a couple of hours, or finding a campsite in the dark.

Now, if you are driving to the park and stop in a pullout, or drive off on a NF road, or stay in one of the campgrounds outside the park, everything changes. You could stay any number of places along 120 or 41 or get a motel room in El Portal.

I will be doing three days on the trail at the end of this month. We are going up Friday afternoon, picking up the permit, staying in the backpacker campground, hopping on the hiker bus at Curry Village, riding to the Cathedral Lakes trailhead, and hiking back to the cars via the JMT with stops at Sunrise HSC and a campsite near Clouds Rest. We will probably climb Clouds instead of Half Dome but ambitious folks could probably do both. It could easily be reversed if you want - get the permit, drive up to the backpacker campground in Tuolumne Meadows campground, park at the trailhead, hike down from Sunrise or from Cathedral, or from the wilderness office up Lyell to the trail to Volgesang and then on down the trail to Half Dome/LYV, head down the hill to the backpacker's campground, catch the hiker bus at Curry Village at 8 am back to the car, drive the rest of Tioga Pass out of the park. Does that sound more like what you are looking for?

[RCRanger03]

The wilderness permit thing is a bit confusing for me, is it just a hike anywhere pass or are there specific permits for specific trails, and how long does a permit last for?

That does sound a alot like something we would like to do, about how long is that, how crowded, and do think it would be ultimately more rewarding for two first timers who may never get to go back than say... Four mile trail, to Panorama trail to LYV to Half Dome (reaching the summit at sunrise)